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Post by MorganBGone on Oct 31, 2016 20:56:02 GMT -5
well, I certainly don't ship Dolores with Teddy. LOL I'm troubled by William's having a "real world" relationship already, though, which acts as a barrier to Willores for me, emotionally speaking. I'll have to decide how much I care going forward. Certainly, William is the only human in the game thus far whom I've remotely liked.
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Post by dark sister on Oct 31, 2016 21:21:29 GMT -5
well, I certainly don't ship Dolores with Teddy. LOL I'm troubled by William's having a "real world" relationship already, though, which acts as a barrier to Willores for me, emotionally speaking. I'll have to decide how much I care going forward. Certainly, William is the only human in the game thus far whom I've remotely liked. Well, it's Logan's sister so if she's anything like him... I thought that too at first, then Logan said his sister probably chose William because he'd roll over easy, then I went full Willores.
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Post by poisonivy on Nov 1, 2016 11:24:45 GMT -5
I'm going to be honest here, as a black woman, so far what I've seen (mostly) is another show about white people doing white people things. Unfortunately, that's the majority of tv experiences in the US, and keeps me from feeling fully invested in most things being produced right now. Westworld is no different. I watch, but beyond Maeve, I don't care enough to root for anyone. Representation matters to me, but if it doesn't matter to tptb, then they don't need my viewership. So you only care about Maeve because of what? Her skin color? That's kinda messed up...
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Post by Sexual Chocolate on Nov 1, 2016 12:06:29 GMT -5
I'm going to be honest here, as a black woman, so far what I've seen (mostly) is another show about white people doing white people things. Unfortunately, that's the majority of tv experiences in the US, and keeps me from feeling fully invested in most things being produced right now. Westworld is no different. I watch, but beyond Maeve, I don't care enough to root for anyone. Representation matters to me, but if it doesn't matter to tptb, then they don't need my viewership. So you only care about Maeve because of what? Her skin color? That's kinda messed up... Where did I say that? Go on, I'll wait.
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Post by poisonivy on Nov 1, 2016 12:44:14 GMT -5
So you only care about Maeve because of what? Her skin color? That's kinda messed up... Where did I say that? Go on, I'll wait. I was asking. Don't bark at me. You go on and on AND ON about that issue and then admit that in the show where you have characters like a grieving father or a host created to be raped and brutalized you ONLY care about Maeve.
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Post by MorganBGone on Nov 1, 2016 13:00:40 GMT -5
Might I hazard a guess that you root for Maeve because she's, to you, the most interesting and potentially even best-acted of the characters, Sexual Chocolate ? Episode 2 was my favourite owing largely to Maeve and, with that, Thandie Newton's performance. I do have to say that after this past episode, I'm definitely feeling more of the characters and more of the story itself, but still the intersection of Maeve and Felix... and that bird... has me intrigued perhaps the most. What was Felix's goal with the bird, and how does that apply to the unique bot it just landed on? I want answers, dagnabbit! It wasn't until this past episode that I really started feeling invested in Dolores at all, despite her early history on the show. I'm not sure why that it... but I just didn't. I also felt little investment in father number 1... and that has nothing to do with race because I use foundation shade 001. Where representation is concerned, I admit I have a hard time relating directly because there is of course an abundance of pasty me on tv. Certainly, based on westworld so far, people my shade of the rainbow seem to make up the majority (all?) of the human players within the theme park. (I'm not sure what that's supposed to say about me??) That said, I work in no small part with an underserviced and Very underrepresented population -- the First Nations community -- and find it truly unfortunate it is that they, and particularly their youth, typically cannot just turn on a mainstream TV station and see themselves represented outside of often tragic news stories. So far, I've primarily seen scalping on Westworld. It would be nice to see something beyond that because violence is hardly the be all and end all of native culture. For me, relatability of characters is often a key determinant of my enjoyment of a show, and, while of course we have commonalities -- basic traits of humanity -- that allow for us to relate to others of different races, I do think it's natural not to invest as deeply where those presented before us can't share important aspects of our experience... if that makes sense? And, race does inform our experiences in a variety of ways. Also, lack of representation does raise questions about target audience and how much consideration writers/producers are even giving to creating something that's respectful of diversity. I hope I haven't overstepped here, but I didn't myself tie your investment in Maeve exclusively to your concern about representation because we'd discussed how interesting Maeve as a character was previously and how strong TN's performance was. I think both hold true regardless of skin colour.
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Post by poisonivy on Nov 1, 2016 13:15:26 GMT -5
What I found curious about that final scene was Maeve being so damn calm. She didn't figure out everything in last episode and here she wakes up, naked, in some futuristic setting, with some dude smiling at a bird and she is CALM? I saw theories she was faking being asleep but:
1. I imagine having strange dudes poke around in you is traumatic to the point she couldn't do that 2. the events were the direct continuation of last week's loop - so she was brought in right after the whole Hector pulling the bullet out/make out session.
So why wasn't she freaked out?
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Post by Sexual Chocolate on Nov 1, 2016 13:25:05 GMT -5
Where did I say that? Go on, I'll wait. I was asking. Don't bark at me. You go on and on AND ON about that issue and then admit that in the show where you have characters like a grieving father or a host created to be raped and brutalized you ONLY care about Maeve. If that's barking to you then you've lived a charmed life. Must be nice. Again, I'm still waiting for you to show me where I wrote I only care about Maeve because of her skin color. If this was true, wouldn't I have also named the character played by Jeffrey Wright. A character that interests me so little that I can't be bothered to remember his name. Since you're so big on assuming shall I join you and speculate as to why you're quick to write "SJW PC garbage" when the topics of inclusion and fair representation are broached? I have a lot of ideas on that one.
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Post by Sexual Chocolate on Nov 1, 2016 13:44:48 GMT -5
Might I hazard a guess that you root for Maeve because she's, to you, the most interesting and potentially even best-acted of the characters, Sexual Chocolate ? Episode 2 was my favourite owing largely to Maeve and, with that, Thandie Newton's performance. I do have to say that after this past episode, I'm definitely feeling more of the characters and more of the story itself, but still the intersection of Maeve and Felix... and that bird... has me intrigued perhaps the most. What was Felix's goal with the bird, and how does that apply to the unique bot it just landed on? I want answers, dagnabbit! It wasn't until this past episode that I really started feeling invested in Dolores at all, despite her early history on the show. I'm not sure why that it... but I just didn't. I also felt little investment in father number 1... and that has nothing to do with race because I use foundation shade 001. Where representation is concerned, I admit I have a hard time relating directly because there is of course an abundance of pasty me on tv. Certainly, based on westworld so far, people my shade of the rainbow seem to make up the majority (all?) of the human players within the theme park. (I'm not sure what that's supposed to say about me??) That said, I work in no small part with an underserviced and Very underrepresented population -- the First Nations community -- and find it truly unfortunate it is that they, and particularly their youth, typically cannot just turn on a mainstream TV station and see themselves represented outside of often tragic news stories. So far, I've primarily seen scalping on Westworld. It would be nice to see something beyond that because violence is hardly the be all and end all of native culture. For me, relatability of characters is often a key determinant of my enjoyment of a show, and, while of course we have commonalities -- basic traits of humanity -- that allow for us to relate to others of different races, I do think it's natural not to invest as deeply where those presented before us can't share important aspects of our experience... if that makes sense? And, race does inform our experiences in a variety of ways. Also, lack of representation does raise questions about target audience and how much consideration writers/producers are even giving to creating something that's respectful of diversity. I hope I haven't overstepped here, but I didn't myself tie your investment in Maeve exclusively to your concern about representation because we'd discussed how interesting Maeve as a character was previously and how strong TN's performance was. I think both hold true regardless of skin colour. In no way have you overstepped. Our mutual enjoyment of Maeve is documented in this thread, and unless I'm mistaken her skin color wasn't discussed. Now back to the topic of representation, the vast majority of non-poc, and men of all races/ethnicity have blinders on when it comes to the lack of racial and gender diversity on screens and in books. And when the topic is brought up, the usual first, second, and third response is something along the lines of 'not everything has to do with race' or 'why can't you enjoy the show for what it is' or as we see in this very thread, "SJW garbage :/" - complete with sad face. Maeve is the only character I give a damn about. Is it nice that she's a woman of color? Absolutely. But is it the only reason? Hell no. I enjoy her because she has layers to her, and her memories intrigue me. So far the rest of the characters can go kick rocks for all I care.
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Post by Ripley on Nov 1, 2016 15:02:20 GMT -5
I'd like to read this discussion without posts judging others with differing opinions.Let's ;ay off harshness too thanks Different aspects of Westworld appeal to each member who watches. That said, no one member should judge others for what interests or is of importance to them. Carry on!
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Post by Ripley on Nov 1, 2016 15:07:26 GMT -5
I find the inner workings of Westworld, the technology fascinating and wish we got more time and insights into how exactly the hosts work, and Felix's mission or agenda here. I agree he needs to be considered fro more than repair work or autopsies, but the corproation seems very rigid plus the power players don't seem aware of him yet.
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Post by Ripley on Nov 7, 2016 0:26:19 GMT -5
Wow this is the episode I have been hoping for between Maeve and Tessa Thompsonl Bernard's discovery of the old unregistered hosts. Anyone catch the homage to Yul Brenner's Man in Black when Barhard entered the old holding area- he was in the first corner, barely illuminated by the flashlight beam.
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Post by dark sister on Nov 7, 2016 0:47:13 GMT -5
I'm glad to see Tessa, I've been looking forward to her. I love that Felix got so much screen time too. He's such a cinnamon roll. My blood pressure was probably off the charts when Elsie was in that house looking at the computer. I was so afraid she was going to get killed. I hope she makes it out alive. MorganBGone should be happy that Teddy finally did something interesting.
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Post by Ripley on Nov 7, 2016 12:28:29 GMT -5
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Post by Ripley on Nov 7, 2016 14:47:38 GMT -5
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Post by Ripley on Nov 14, 2016 9:21:15 GMT -5
Sharing here the refreshing Westworld showrunners' view on spoilers, fan theories & "playing fair" with viewers, THR www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/westworld-bernard-twist-explained-946507 THR: "...Westworld is wrapped in mystery and secrecy. It's a show that invites speculation and theorizing. Some fans certainly have been wondering whether or not Bernard's a host. There are other theories that some fans feel they're closing in on as well — they could be very right, or very wrong. I'm curious about your perspective on that, the Reddit age of consuming a show like Westworld. If people see the bullets coming, is that distressing to you as a writer? Or is it exciting that viewers are paying close enough attention to pick up on these clues and get their suspicions rewarded in some cases? Nolan: I think it's both. It's very exciting when people correctly guess where the narrative is going, because you've done your job. I'm very much a believer that you have to on some level play fair with the audience. I do this for a living, so there are many movies over the years that I've guessed the ending to, and thoroughly enjoyed anyway. Lisa and I both watch and adore Mr. Robot. It's a good global example. I love Reddit. I've been reading Reddit. I don't do social media, and Reddit is sort of the non-social version of social media. I've been reading that website for the better part of a decade. But for shows I like, I don't tend to go to the subreddit while the series is ongoing, because I don't want it spoiled. The thing about theorizing is that occasionally, you're going to be right. The distinction between a theory and a spoiler becomes moot if someone guesses correctly. With a sufficient number of guesses and with an organizing mechanism like Reddit, where good guesses can get more karma, people are going to deduce things that are correct about the show — and they're going to deduce things that aren't correct. But you do have the ability to spoil it for yourself. For myself, I stayed away from the Mr. Robot subreddit, because I didn't want to know. I want to experience the show fresh. That said, [Mr. Robot creator] Sam Esmail very carefully and beautifully lays in and plays fair with the audience. He lays in the clues you'll need, not because you need to solve a puzzle, but because that show reflects the reality of the character. That character has a tenuous grip on reality. Our show is very similar. Our hosts, as we've told you from the beginning, they don't fully understand the world around them. Their reality is curated. Their memory is either non-existent or carefully curated or accidental, so their experience of memory is something we're playing with in the show. Bernard's experience with the reality around him is something we're playing with in the show. When he walks into the cottage, twice now, in the previous episode, Ford appears as if out of thin air. Having watched the next episode, you now understand that there was a door there. There's a literal door that Bernard is unable to see until Theresa steps through it. The idea that his reality is curated is something that's been feeding the narrative from the very first episode. We wanted to lay it in as carefully as possible. Ultimately, you make these shows the way you would like to experience them. If you're playing fair with the audience, there's some indication along the way of where the narrative is going. But I also like to be surprised. Joy: The important thing for me, the way that I approach these things, is that it's also not just about the reveal. It's not just about whether or not you guessed that Bernard is a host. It's about what happens next, and that's not about reveals. It's all about character and emotions. We now know that he's a host, and it's an aha moment. But the thing that happens next is far more devastating. We see the implications of that reveal play out on the character level. He's forced to kill his lover, and the toll it takes on him… that, for me, is the part of the episode that truly wallops me. The twist is one thing, but the way that it lands? That's what sticks.
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Post by MorganBGone on Nov 14, 2016 9:55:12 GMT -5
Ripley, thank you for posting that. It clarifies quite well why Westworld is a superior show to TWD. The clues are there but function within the narrative, and the goal outcome is not the reveal but the fallout, which, on Westworld, comes in sequence, not 3 episodes later if at all. And, those reveals and big moments follow from the narrative, rather than coming out of left field so as to "surprise" the audience. Gimple clearly loves to plan the show out well in advance, but that planning should yield a cohesive story with flow, not a bunch of Easter eggs, parallels, cliffhangers, and wtf moments. This just highlights how ineffective he is as a show runner.
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Post by Ripley on Nov 14, 2016 10:12:18 GMT -5
I'm glad to see realistic showrunners who not only understand spoiler appeal but who also know how to avoid spoilers they don't want for the shows they watch. Their enjoyment of Reddit and refusal to see those who like spoilers as "enemies" or "dangerous" is great. They understand their viewers, the habits of viewers and accept it, not fight, try to prevent or shame folks fir liking abd keeping up with spoilers/fan theories, etc.
The "fair play" comment I especially like as well as their being ok that people guess correctly what happens. I'd wondered and thought about Bernard long before last night and still enjoyed the confirmation and the twists and turns of the episode with Maeve
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Westworld
Nov 14, 2016 22:51:54 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by dark sister on Nov 14, 2016 22:51:54 GMT -5
Westworld has been renewed for a 2nd season! They say it should be back in early 2018 due to the shooting schedule.
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Post by Ripley on Nov 15, 2016 20:17:28 GMT -5
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Post by Ripley on Nov 20, 2016 23:02:18 GMT -5
www.ew.com/article/2016/11/20/westworld-season-2"...Speaking to BBC Radio 4, Harris recalled how he was chatting with Westworld showrunners Jonathan Nolan and Lisa Joy. “I was just talking to Jonah Nolan last night, who’s a creator of this thing with his wife Lisa Joy, and yeah, they’re doing another season,” he said. “They’re going to do 10 more episodes, and I will be involved.” Fans have assumed that the MiB was going to get killed off in the final episodes given that his character has made so many cryptic references to dying on the show (plus, Harris is a rather big star who gets plenty of other opportunities out there). Of course, just because Harris will be “involved” in season 2 doesn’t mean that his character won’t also die – Westworld’s unique world-building allows characters to potentially live on as a robotic host. .."
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Post by MorganBGone on Nov 20, 2016 23:25:08 GMT -5
If Thandie Newton doesn't take home boatloads of awards for this show, I'll be crying "rigged" more than Donald Trump.
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Post by dark sister on Nov 20, 2016 23:32:09 GMT -5
I really hope this is the episode that is submitted for Evan, Thandie, and Jeffrey they were amazing tonight. Yeah, that two timeline theory is all but confirmed when the MIB said "I thought they would've retired you" to the blonde host. She's the one that brought William into the park. Elsie I kind of laughed to myself during MIBs monologue. That's how you do it. Take note, Negan.
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Post by Ripley on Nov 21, 2016 10:29:28 GMT -5
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Post by Ripley on Nov 21, 2016 16:28:51 GMT -5
You called it Sexual Chocolate- Forbes has officially gone full Shane on TWD with the review, the "Ogg is better than Morgan's Negan or Amelio's Dwight" piece and now the compariosn of Westworld with TWD, to the latter's detriment! "It’s so refreshing to watch a show like Westworld right after watching AMC’s The Walking Dead. The former is a mature, well-plotted TV program with terrific characters, some of the best acting around, and a story that draws you in and ensnares you completely. The latter is a meandering mish-mash of half-baked ideas and poorly drawn characters that has no excuse for being so relentlessly mediocre. Of course, Westworld makes its viewership pay attention, and entices us to think. This is not low-brow zombie fare—something that, once upon a time, I wouldn’t have called The Walking Dead either. Oh well...." www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2016/11/20/westworld-just-dropped-a-huge-clue-about-another-big-fan-theory/#4f988b933ce4
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Westworld
Nov 21, 2016 21:19:19 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by MorganBGone on Nov 21, 2016 21:19:19 GMT -5
You called it Sexual Chocolate- Forbes has officially gone full Shane on TWD with the review, the "Ogg is better than Morgan's Negan or Amelio's Dwight" piece and now the compariosn of Westworld with TWD, to the latter's detriment! "It’s so refreshing to watch a show like Westworld right after watching AMC’s The Walking Dead. The former is a mature, well-plotted TV program with terrific characters, some of the best acting around, and a story that draws you in and ensnares you completely. The latter is a meandering mish-mash of half-baked ideas and poorly drawn characters that has no excuse for being so relentlessly mediocre. Of course, Westworld makes its viewership pay attention, and entices us to think. This is not low-brow zombie fare—something that, once upon a time, I wouldn’t have called The Walking Dead either. Oh well...." www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2016/11/20/westworld-just-dropped-a-huge-clue-about-another-big-fan-theory/#4f988b933ce4 media2.giphy.com/media/E99OMc6pkdvGw/giphy.gif
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Post by Ripley on Nov 28, 2016 0:06:07 GMT -5
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Post by dark sister on Nov 28, 2016 0:37:38 GMT -5
Fuuuuuuuuuuuuck Westworld was good tonight! So many theories confirmed, the photos, Bernard being made in Arnold's image, the multiple time lines.
Next week is going to be bittersweet, I'm so excited for it, but then it will be awful not seeing it again until 2018.
I really, really hope this isn't the last we've seen of Bernard. Someone needs to fix him. Then they need to find Elsie and Stubbs.
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Post by Ripley on Nov 28, 2016 0:41:46 GMT -5
And turn Ford into a host just to balance the account sheet dark sister
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Post by Ripley on Nov 28, 2016 17:30:42 GMT -5
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