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Post by Sexual Chocolate on Mar 25, 2016 16:05:12 GMT -5
For some time now, many fans of Michonne have been disappointed in her lack of screen time and/or her arc? Yes, we have the comic as a guide but TV Michonne is not Comic Michonne. If she makes it to season 7, and we all know she will, share what you want to see for her and from her going forward.
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Post by doctorwhat on Mar 25, 2016 16:23:28 GMT -5
Quite honestly anything. I am just done with saying what I want to happen, because it just leads to disappointment. For instance, with all the mother-imagery in this last half, I would've wagered money that Michonne would've brought up Andre. That her motherhood would've been brought up to the forefront with the fact she'd been welcomed in the Grimes family. But, nah. Of course it didn't happen. I shouldn't have been surprised. Honestly I've lost hope Michonne will ever reference her dead three-year-old on the series. Quite frankly I don't think Gimple or any of his writers give a shit about Michonne's past. She's just the cool sword-swinger who happens to be banging the lead. And that's all she ever be to the people behind the curtain.
So, yeah. Anything would be good. Really just put her on my screen. Of course "Danai is a successful playwright" is the Free Space on the "TWD Writer's Excuse Bingo" when it comes to Michonne disappearing into the shadows, so, no hope for even that.
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Post by Ripley on Mar 25, 2016 17:16:54 GMT -5
I want to Michonne remain Michonne, not get stuck as just Mrs Rick or Mother O' Carl $ Judith. Sure those are important aspects of her life and who she is, but I'm always a big fan of couples being written interestingly and not as simply one half of a pair. Gleggie have never made the " hey, we aren't just Siamese twins" mostly. It's like that wedding unity candle thing I find so annoying- 1+1 should equal 2 abd not each person becoming only a part of "The Relationship" for instance. To me Richonne ( and other pairings in RL as well as in fiction ) should equal 3- both individuals with the third being what they create as a couple. Now that Richonne is canon, it doesn't surprise me we haven't seen much after they " will they or won't they?" Tension has stopped. TPTB would rather have fans ecstatic over a few tiny bits than bored with a lot. That happens with all shows. I want Michonne to remain herself, speak her mind and disagree with Rick and anyone else as she sees fit & has done in past seasons. I want her strong, active and supporting other people with the wonderful skills/talents she has, knowing when to be tough or soft, when to encourage vs shut down a possible bad call. Great topic Sexual Chocolate.
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Post by booksrbetter on Mar 25, 2016 18:22:03 GMT -5
Michonne has turned into a boring character. Every so often she whirls a sword around and the rest of the time she cold trails Rick around. I thought the Richonne hookup was badly done. Them getting together the episode after the death of the Anderson family was a little jarring and there was never any real conversation between them. She never talked about Andre or even Andrea with Rick. Michonne has nothing to do but agree with Rick. At least last year she brained him when he went postal in the street.
I see the same problem with all the romances though. Suddenly Abe wants Abe. Carol is sleeping with Tobin. Rosita with Spencer (though I thought that was some rebound thing)'
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Post by Sexual Chocolate on Mar 25, 2016 18:42:34 GMT -5
I have no idea what Michonne's arc will be because the two monkeys playing with a yoyo inside Gimple's head come up with some nonsensical shit. What I want for her:
1. Continue to build an identity beyond Rick's romantic partner and right hand woman. My fear is her arc will really be Rick's and she's just going along for the ride.
2. Develop true female friendships that aren't one-offs where she and Rosita have a quick heart to heart and then barely acknowledge each other again.
3. Andre. Andre. Andre.
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Post by doctorwhat on Mar 25, 2016 19:25:46 GMT -5
I hate to bring up race, but I think the fact Michonne is a black woman will be a roadblock in how the writers ever engage her character. I am pleased as hell they went forward with Richonne in spite of that Michonne isn't only a black woman, but a dark-skinned black woman (Andy even said it would take political balls), which is understandably very different in the eyes of a Western audience (and is still met with reticence and ire if anyone is monitoring social media); I think that will forever slap her on the backburner in respect to the white female characters (Carol, Maggie) even though she's the romantic counterpart to the leading man (Rick). While TWD is progressive, it still dips its toes into the racist end of the pond far too often for comfort in my opinion.
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Post by Sexual Chocolate on Mar 25, 2016 19:56:21 GMT -5
I hate to bring up race, but I think the fact Michonne is a black woman will be a roadblock in how the writers ever engage her character. I am pleased as hell they went forward with Richonne in spite of that Michonne isn't only a black woman, but a dark-skinned black woman (Andy even said it would take political balls), which is understandably very different in the eyes of a Western audience (and is still met with reticence and ire if anyone is monitoring social media); I think that will forever slap her on the backburner in respect to the white female characters (Carol, Maggie) even though she's the romantic counterpart to the leading man (Rick). While TWD is progressive, it still dips its toes into the racist end of the pond far too often for comfort in my opinion. Hold onto your socks, but I think in the writers' eyes Michonne being a dark skinned black woman holds the character back in a way not being discussed. The writers are afraid to give her anything controversial because of possible criticism that may come their way. They're afraid of being called racists, even moreso than they already have. Imagine if TV Michonne had as many sexual partners as comic Michonne? Assholes are still calling Lori and Andrea sluts, but Shane and the Governor got free passes to be sexual as they wanted to be. Shane even attempted to rape Lori, but somehow that's rarely remembered. How about having a dark-skinned black woman shoot lily white Lizzie in the head? Would the reaction have been the same? Maybe. Maybe not but there's a chance the writers' didn't want to find out. How often has Michonne been given something controversial to do? Killing the screaming man in the cabin back in season 3? Killing Ron Anderson? Please she could have stuck a rocket up his ass and launched him into orbit and 99% of the viewing audience would have cheered. Michonne has been getting Daryled and not in the way the Dichonne shippers wanted to happen. Like Daryl, she has been firmly placed in the "play it safe" box and safe isn't always the most fun to write or watch. This is one reason, I think she's been put on the backburner.
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Post by doctorwhat on Mar 25, 2016 20:10:52 GMT -5
I hate to bring up race, but I think the fact Michonne is a black woman will be a roadblock in how the writers ever engage her character. I am pleased as hell they went forward with Richonne in spite of that Michonne isn't only a black woman, but a dark-skinned black woman (Andy even said it would take political balls), which is understandably very different in the eyes of a Western audience (and is still met with reticence and ire if anyone is monitoring social media); I think that will forever slap her on the backburner in respect to the white female characters (Carol, Maggie) even though she's the romantic counterpart to the leading man (Rick). While TWD is progressive, it still dips its toes into the racist end of the pond far too often for comfort in my opinion. Hold onto your socks, but I think in the writers' eyes Michonne being a dark skinned black woman holds the character back in a way not being discussed. The writers are afraid to give her anything controversial because of possible criticism that may come their way. They're afraid of being called racists, even moreso than they already have. Imagine if TV Michonne had as many sexual partners as comic Michonne? Assholes are still calling Lori and Andrea sluts, but Shane and the Governor got free passes to be sexual as they wanted to be. Shane even attempted to rape Lori, but somehow that's rarely remembered. How about having a dark-skinned black woman shoot lily white Lizzie in the head? Would the reaction have been the same? Maybe. Maybe not but there's a chance the writers' didn't want to find out. How often has Michonne been given something controversial to do? Killing the screaming man in the cabin back in season 3? Killing Ron Anderson? Please she could have stuck a rocket up his ass and launched him into orbit and 99% of the viewing audience would have cheered. Michonne has been getting Daryled and not in the way the Dichonne shippers wanted to happen. Like Daryl, she has been firmly placed in the "play it safe" box and safe isn't always the most fun to write or watch. This is one reason, I think she's been put on the backburner. This discussion was also touched upon recently in a venting thread over on another forum -- that per not only's Michonne's gender but also her race -- she was going to be treated with kid gloves. Gimple indicated that for a while he wanted to slot Michonne into the role of Rick's love interest. As such, she was going to have to be almost perfect. If she deviated even slightly from that trajectory, not only would the rampant sexists come after her (as they had Lori and Andrea) but also the racists (who are still pouring out of the woodwork on social media). Being dark-skinned, Michonne is already at more of a disadvantage than other black women might be with light skin, which made her situation even more "delicate" in the eyes of capitalistic showrunners. Yes, it's great they wanted to go full-steam ahead with Richonne anyway and I am forever greatful (as a Richonne shipper), but JFC did they hold Michonne back from doing anything far from perfect. What's worse is, as a Michonne fan, it's hard to complain either. Michonne is funny, smart, charismatic, beautiful, she has her shit together, the leading male character loves her. But then she's restricted in this realm that some people are beginning to regard her as boring, stagnant, etc. I don't think she's boring as I see she has layers under the surface (she is a killer, she dragged around the reanimated corpse of her boyfriend, she has anger issues, etc.) but we're not allowed to see that side as much since Gimple took over. I think, in part, due to this knowledge that if Michonne were allowed to go "off the leash", she would be "unworthy" of the great white penis (and I hate calling it that, but let's be real). Michonne can't win. Because fans either view her through this hyper-progressive lens thus not registering she's going to be held back by writers due to her dark-skin and gender (oh man she's boring she doesn't do anything controversial) OR through the mass audience who slut-shamed Lori and Andrea (Michonne better damn near be perfect to get near Ricky). She's screwed either way you slice it. (No pun intended.)
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Post by Sexual Chocolate on Mar 25, 2016 20:42:39 GMT -5
doctorwhat I don't know if Michonne can win either, at least with the writers. If fans weren't happy with the direction Michonne's story was going since Gimple took over, then I doubt they'll be happy with it going forward. One major criticism (yes, even from fans) about the character is that she rarely existed outside the realm of the Grimes family. Great for those who only see her with shippers goggles, not so great for everyone else. Now that Richonne is canon, why would it change? How could it change?
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Post by doctorwhat on Mar 25, 2016 21:04:31 GMT -5
doctorwhat I don't know if Michonne can win either, at least with the writers. If fans weren't happy with the direction Michonne's story was going since Gimple took over, then I doubt they'll be happy with it going forward. One major criticism (yes, even from fans) about the character is that she rarely existed outside the realm of the Grimes family. Great for those who only see her with shippers goggles, not so great for everyone else. Now that Richonne is canon, why would it change? How could it change? I've seen her outside the realm of the Grimes family. In season three, she had her arc with Andrea, which fueled her vengeance towards the Governor. In 4A, she spent most of her time with Daryl and others as she went outside the prison on her manhunt of the Governor (which was a carry-over from season three); hell that's what spawned the ship Dixonne. Only in 4B did Michonne cement a bond with Grimes family, and even then it went on the backburner in season 5 for the most part (she only had one scene with Carl and they never spoke to one another that entire season). In 5B, she had scenes with Abraham, Sasha, and Rosita. In 6A, she had "Thank You" which was spent almost entirely away from Rick (she mostly interacted with Glenn). In 6B, the Grimes dynamic has come back to the forefront. I think it's more that some of Michonne's most memorable and well-liked scenes are with either Carl or Rick. While they're a large part of who she is, they don't define her. In fact, it's one of my biggest pet peeves when people try to peddle that Michonne is "all about the Grimes" because she's not. In fact, in episode breakdown totals, she's not. But that's just what people remember. Sometimes I think some fans honestly hold that as a grudge against her for one reason or another, which confuses me -- especially considering it could be more so argued that Carl is "all about Michonne" (given his last big steps in character advancement were with Michonne) or Rick is "all about Michonne" (since he's practically whipped as has been seen in memes). I don't begrudge the Richonne connection because I think it was a natural step in her character progression. Danai has said the same. Michonne started off as this wounded, closed-off individual because she was on the heels of losing her son and boyfriend. She withdrew from human connection as a result. Her bond with Rick and Carl was her reconnecting with those scarred-up parts of herself. So I think it's a wonderful thing. What's unfortunate is not the same amount of narrative weight is placed on aspects of Michonne outside of that Grimes 2.0 framework -- even though we've seen it. The Grimes don't define who Michonne is, but unfortunately it's the most heavily emphasized part since Gimple took over. I love it -- and dislike it -- at the same time. I just wish the writers would feel more free with Michonne, but I do think Gimple feels his hands are tied with how far he can go with Michonne. It hurts, but I think that's just how it is.
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Post by darkandstormy on Mar 26, 2016 12:56:15 GMT -5
I agree that any screen time that has Michonne in it, would be awesome. I've given up on the hope that she will have a conversation with Rick about her past. So much is assumed with Rick and Michonne. I assume they have sex ~ even though we don't see it ~ because they wake up in bed together. I also assume they have conversations that I don't hear. Maybe TPTB think it's easier and more expedient to have the audience "assume" that these things are occurring, off screen. Just like Gleggie's marriage. When did that occur...because it always felt like another assumption to me.
In some ways I feel cheated out of the hot sex scenes I wanted. Cheated out of the conversations that I wanted. So, in order for me not to think that Michonne has permanently been sidelined, going forward I'd like to have her involved in things that use her brains, and her femininity, not just her brawn. Being the observant Michonne. Not that I want her to put down the sword, but I want her talking, and getting to know others, like Rosita, who appears to be going through hell at the moment. Maybe revelations about each of their backgrounds will fill in the blanks for me. I want Michonne to resume her friendship with Daryl and I want more conversations between those two. Why couldn't she be involved in some intrigue, where she investigates her suspicions about something? I don't think I'm asking for too much.
A friend of mine and I are of the opinion that if we'd known that Richonne was going to become a run-of-the-mill couple, it would be better for Michonne to have an arc with Negan. She still could. JDM as Negan is going to be riveting. I'd like to see some kind of a Negan/Michonne interaction in the long term. However, we are nearing the end of the season, with other more immediately pressing matters, but next season awaits!
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Post by Sexual Chocolate on Mar 26, 2016 13:44:33 GMT -5
Re: Andre
If Gimple wasn't such a fucking simpleton (have you noticed he's not my favorite person?) there are limitless ways Michonne can bring up Andre. Maggie's pregnant, everybody is excited for her but at the same time those who have lost children are feeling some sadness too. Have Michonne talk to Rick about her own fear? of getting pregnant and having another child. Maybe this is the first time Rick learns of Andre, maybe not, but the discussion is born out of Maggie's circumstance and Richonne's new relationship.
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Post by sparklyunicorn on Mar 26, 2016 14:10:57 GMT -5
I can't even remember the last time Michonne's had a storyline of her own separate from Rick. Seems like every female on the show other than Carol is solely being used as a love interest atm.
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Post by booksrbetter on Mar 26, 2016 14:52:32 GMT -5
Michonne's arc is safe. She is the love interest of the leading man, beloved by his children, and given the kiss of leadership from the dying Deanna. Frankly, my dear she's a little dull. Right now Carol has flow the coop, Sasha is given up lying with corpses to lying with Abe (too close to call), Rosita is finding some dialogue and personality, Maggie's preggers but still figured how to survive being captured by Saviors. On the other hand, Michonne is holding hands with Rick and more (according to spoiler video). Not a bad job, but safe. She can phone it in from now on. Nothing can happen to Rick, Carl, or Baby Judith (Please God don't let anything happen to the baby). Safe and boring.
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Post by Mia on Mar 26, 2016 16:31:57 GMT -5
Gimple has pretty much screwed up all the women on the show. He really needs to get over that crap.
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Post by doctorwhat on Mar 26, 2016 18:01:57 GMT -5
Re: Andre If Gimple wasn't such a fucking simpleton (have you noticed he's not my favorite person?) there are limitless ways Michonne can bring up Andre. Maggie's pregnant, everybody is excited for her but at the same time those who have lost children are feeling some sadness too. Have Michonne talk to Rick about her own fear? of getting pregnant and having another child. Maybe this is the first time Rick learns of Andre, maybe not, but the discussion is born out of Maggie's circumstance and Richonne's new relationship. I think if Andre is ever brought up in the future it will be in conjunction with Maggie's pregnancy. If Maggie suffers a miscarriage, I could see the potential of Michonne comforting Maggie and telling her about Andre. Otherwise I can't imagine when it would happen.
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Post by dark sister on Apr 16, 2016 6:51:26 GMT -5
Re: Andre If Gimple wasn't such a fucking simpleton (have you noticed he's not my favorite person?) there are limitless ways Michonne can bring up Andre. Maggie's pregnant, everybody is excited for her but at the same time those who have lost children are feeling some sadness too. Have Michonne talk to Rick about her own fear? of getting pregnant and having another child. Maybe this is the first time Rick learns of Andre, maybe not, but the discussion is born out of Maggie's circumstance and Richonne's new relationship. I think if Andre is ever brought up in the future it will be in conjunction with Maggie's pregnancy. If Maggie suffers a miscarriage, I could see the potential of Michonne comforting Maggie and telling her about Andre. Otherwise I can't imagine when it would happen. While that would also be a nice sceen....I want her to tell Rick about him, damn it!
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